Message boards : CMS Application : Is there a Native version in the pipeline?
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Dark Angel

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Message 46815 - Posted: 24 May 2022, 21:00:29 UTC

That's it, straight question. Is there a native version in development/under consideration/even possible for CMS?
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ivan
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Message 46864 - Posted: 10 Jun 2022, 10:37:08 UTC - in response to Message 46815.  

That's it, straight question. Is there a native version in development/under consideration/even possible for CMS?

No, not at the moment anyway. We figured long ago that a VM was the easiest way to run on the most popular CPU on the most popular operating systems with the least hassle. Of course the technology has changed a lot since, I don't even know if it's possible to run emulated x64 VirtualBox on the latest Macs. I believe there are versions of CMSSW now for Arm, PP, and GPU machines as well as x64, but have no idea how easy it would be to set up native versions of these to run on BOINC. At the moment we are still in a development phase, but getting closer to real production running. Until that happens and we get a lot more users, it's not worth spending the time.
BTW, someone has got hold of an AMD engineering sample 256-core CPU! Take a look at the job graphs since 09/06.
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Message 46882 - Posted: 13 Jun 2022, 0:25:37 UTC - in response to Message 46864.  
Last modified: 13 Jun 2022, 0:38:56 UTC

BTW, someone has got hold of an AMD engineering sample 256-core CPU! Take a look at the job graphs since 09/06.

https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/show_host_detail.php?hostid=10801742 without Proxy!
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Dark Angel

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Message 46898 - Posted: 15 Jun 2022, 23:29:05 UTC

You mean one of these?: https://www.amd.com/en/products/cpu/amd-epyc-7742

Dual CPU configuration 128t for each CPU gives 256 threads.
The RAM alone to run it would cost a fortune!
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ivan
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Message 46899 - Posted: 16 Jun 2022, 7:06:22 UTC - in response to Message 46898.  

You mean one of these?: https://www.amd.com/en/products/cpu/amd-epyc-7742

Dual CPU configuration 128t for each CPU gives 256 threads.
The RAM alone to run it would cost a fortune!

Something bigger than that, I think. I found an article discussing an upcoming AMD CPU that tiles several chips into one CPU package. 256 cores, 512 threads, 600W TDP -- water-cooling obligatory! The headline was the economy of 1.7 W per thread (which actually gets closer to 900 W in total), which is apparently better than most contemporary chips.
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Message 46900 - Posted: 16 Jun 2022, 8:06:24 UTC - in response to Message 46899.  
Last modified: 16 Jun 2022, 8:27:58 UTC

Water-Cooling alone is no solution. Have seen this with Threadripper 3995.
There is some heat up to 3 times more than in the nature.
Hoping for the future also without air condition!
Energy come since 10 years from renewable.
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Message 47110 - Posted: 8 Aug 2022, 13:04:20 UTC - in response to Message 46864.  

At the moment we are still in a development phase, but getting closer to real production running.

I am not clear what the terms development and real production mean in this context. Are the development results used by the greater CMS collaborative? One would assume so because CMS has been in the development phase for such a long time?

What will be the difference in the project when CMS moves to "real production"?

Thank you.
Regards,
Bob P.
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Message 47122 - Posted: 10 Aug 2022, 7:50:29 UTC - in response to Message 47110.  

At the moment we are still in a development phase, but getting closer to real production running.

I am not clear what the terms development and real production mean in this context. Are the development results used by the greater CMS collaborative? One would assume so because CMS has been in the development phase for such a long time?

Unfortunately, CMS has not embraced LHC@Home with the same enthusiasm that ATLAS has, so it's been a long struggle to get things done. We've been running the same test-flow for a couple of years now but I try from time to time to find a project that otherwise doesn't have high official priority.

What will be the difference in the project when CMS moves to "real production"?

Thank you.

For a start, my job will become easier as control will pass to centralised Submission Infrastructure. The jobs will become more variable, and probably less highly-tuned to Volunteer limitations. We would hope to see an increase in the number of volunteers as we finally start to publicise the project.
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Message 47169 - Posted: 24 Aug 2022, 15:58:41 UTC - in response to Message 47122.  

Thanks for the update. But it seems to me that we should have been warned about their lack of enthusiasm, and the type of work we were doing.
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Message 47400 - Posted: 21 Oct 2022, 10:14:12 UTC - in response to Message 46864.  

That's it, straight question. Is there a native version in development/under consideration/even possible for CMS?

Until...we get a lot more users, it's not worth spending the time.
Catch-22: You'll never get a lot of users until you have a native app for Linux.
I will never install VirtualBox for any reason. Tried that and it's nothing but trouble.
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Message boards : CMS Application : Is there a Native version in the pipeline?


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