Message boards : Theory Application : New Native Theory Version 1.1
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Profile Laurence
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Message 38714 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 7:30:29 UTC

This new version updates cranky to v0.29. It now prints the parameters from the rivet log early and also the timestamps are in local time. The work unit deadline has also been increased to 10 days.
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computezrmle
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Message 38715 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 8:05:40 UTC

It's still a beta app.
At -dev it was announced to become a non-beta app.
??
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Profile Laurence
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Message 38716 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 8:17:55 UTC - in response to Message 38715.  

It's still a beta app.
At -dev it was announced to become a non-beta app.
??

Not until the credit issue is solved. This is still pending.
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computezrmle
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Message 38718 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 10:20:41 UTC - in response to Message 38716.  

Not until the credit issue is solved. This is still pending.

Looks much better now.
Both tasks are from the same client.

Old
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/result.php?resultid=220670558
runtime: 8227.16
CPU-time: 4990.17
Credit: 8.15

New
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/result.php?resultid=222886697
runtime: 7283.42
CPU-time: 3936.66
Credit: 90.40
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Crystal Pellet
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Message 38722 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 11:16:12 UTC - in response to Message 38718.  

Not until the credit issue is solved. This is still pending.

Looks much better now.
New version:
222899438 111652803 7 May 2019, 9:34:58 UTC 7 May 2019, 10:35:49 UTC Completed and validated 3,651.00 4,138.07 33.03 Theory Native v1.01 (native_theory)
x86_64-pc-linux-gnu
222886516 111644746 7 May 2019, 7:52:10 UTC 7 May 2019, 8:27:20 UTC Completed and validated 2,110.00 2,365.96 19.09 Theory Native v1.01 (native_theory)
x86_64-pc-linux-gnu

Older version:
221939767 111143242 2 May 2019, 16:01:24 UTC 2 May 2019, 23:36:38 UTC Completed and validated 27,314.00 28,137.72 29.48 Theory Native v1.00 (native_theory)
x86_64-pc-linux-gnu
220487085 110020403 3 Apr 2019, 7:04:27 UTC 3 Apr 2019, 8:21:49 UTC Completed and validated 4,642.00 4,785.21 6.66 Theory Native v1.00 (native_theory)
x86_64-pc-linux-gnu
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computezrmle
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Message 38724 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 14:34:08 UTC - in response to Message 38718.  

Looks much better now.


Unfortunately only the first one.
Other results still get low credits:

222968397 	111688357 	10575017 	7 May 2019, 11:09:57 UTC 	7 May 2019, 13:48:40 UTC 	Fertig und BestÃĪtigt 	9,507.56 	5,512.14 	11.83 	Theory Native v1.01 (native_theory) x86_64-pc-linux-gnu
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Crystal Pellet
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Message 38733 - Posted: 7 May 2019, 17:23:14 UTC - in response to Message 38724.  

Unfortunately only the first one.
For me only the first two tasks. Beginners luck.
The third task get low credits again.
Completed and validated - Run time: 9,373.00 sec. - CPU time: 10,646.50 sec. - Credit 8.48
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Message 38784 - Posted: 12 May 2019, 16:51:51 UTC

what surprises me: as per info from the Server Status page, Theory Native shows between 16 and 20 crunchers in the "users in past 24 hours" column.

Is this really so? Or are these figures wrong for any reason?

I couldn't image that it made sense to develop this native app for just such a small number of users.
Or am I missing something?
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Profile Ray Murray
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Message 38786 - Posted: 12 May 2019, 18:27:42 UTC - in response to Message 38784.  

It could just be that users are continuing to use the standard VBox version, either because they don't know it's an available option for Linux or, like myself, CAN'T use it as my 3 hosts are all Windows.
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Message 38787 - Posted: 12 May 2019, 22:15:21 UTC - in response to Message 38784.  

what surprises me: as per info from the Server Status page, Theory Native shows between 16 and 20 crunchers in the "users in past 24 hours" column.I

I just assumed that they have tried it, gotten hung up with a long runner, and abandoned it. The remaining people are either willing to babysit their machine, or haven't run into the problem yet.
I am waiting for the numbers to pick up a bit before jumping in again.
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Message 38792 - Posted: 13 May 2019, 9:38:43 UTC
Last modified: 13 May 2019, 9:39:18 UTC

Master file download succeeded
Server error: feeder not running
Tested with and without Test-Application-Preference and
reset of Project.
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Message 38794 - Posted: 13 May 2019, 11:12:46 UTC

Mon 13 May 2019 02:29:21 AM MDT | LHC@home | Started upload of TheoryN_2279-800506-55_0_r1972795353_result
Mon 13 May 2019 02:29:24 AM MDT | LHC@home | Finished upload of TheoryN_2279-800506-55_0_r1972795353_result
Mon 13 May 2019 02:32:19 AM MDT | LHC@home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
Mon 13 May 2019 02:32:19 AM MDT | LHC@home | Reporting 2 completed tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 02:32:19 AM MDT | LHC@home | Requesting new tasks for CPU
Mon 13 May 2019 02:34:21 AM MDT | | Project communication failed: attempting access to reference site
Mon 13 May 2019 02:34:21 AM MDT | LHC@home | Scheduler request failed: Timeout was reached
Mon 13 May 2019 02:34:23 AM MDT | | Internet access OK - project servers may be temporarily down.
Mon 13 May 2019 02:41:41 AM MDT | LHC@home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
Mon 13 May 2019 02:41:41 AM MDT | LHC@home | Reporting 2 completed tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 02:41:41 AM MDT | LHC@home | Requesting new tasks for CPU
Mon 13 May 2019 02:41:43 AM MDT | LHC@home | Scheduler request completed: got 0 new tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 02:41:43 AM MDT | LHC@home | Server can't open database
Mon 13 May 2019 02:59:49 AM MDT | LHC@home | Computation for task Theory_3365477_1557644839.539115_0 finished
Mon 13 May 2019 03:41:48 AM MDT | LHC@home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
Mon 13 May 2019 03:41:48 AM MDT | LHC@home | Reporting 3 completed tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 03:41:48 AM MDT | LHC@home | Requesting new tasks for CPU
Mon 13 May 2019 03:42:01 AM MDT | LHC@home | Scheduler request completed: got 0 new tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 03:42:01 AM MDT | LHC@home | Server error: feeder not running
Mon 13 May 2019 04:42:05 AM MDT | LHC@home | Sending scheduler request: To report completed tasks.
Mon 13 May 2019 04:42:05 AM MDT | LHC@home | Reporting 3 completed tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 04:42:05 AM MDT | LHC@home | Requesting new tasks for CPU
Mon 13 May 2019 04:42:17 AM MDT | LHC@home | Scheduler request completed: got 0 new tasks
Mon 13 May 2019 04:42:17 AM MDT | LHC@home | Server error: feeder not running
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Message 38795 - Posted: 13 May 2019, 11:21:23 UTC - in response to Message 38792.  

Server error: feeder not running
same problem here; and strange enough: the Server Status Page shows that the feeder is running.
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Message 38803 - Posted: 13 May 2019, 13:01:30 UTC - in response to Message 38787.  

what surprises me: as per info from the Server Status page, Theory Native shows between 16 and 20 crunchers in the "users in past 24 hours" column.I

I just assumed that they have tried it, gotten hung up with a long runner, and abandoned it. The remaining people are either willing to babysit their machine, or haven't run into the problem yet.


Native theory won't gain wider acceptance until it has a mechanism for graceful shutdown. My watchdog script circumvents the "run past deadline" and the "disk limit exceeded" problems but it does so by aborting the task. That's not user friendly to volunteers who expect credits. Hopefully the new native Theory allows graceful shutdown. Or maybe crunchers can add it by putting a <completion_trigger_file> line in one of the config files.
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Message 38807 - Posted: 13 May 2019, 14:21:10 UTC - in response to Message 38803.  

Native theory won't gain wider acceptance until it has a mechanism for graceful shutdown.

It may be one of the reasons, yes.


Another one is most likely the poor credit reward.
Let's see what Laurence's changes will bring.
I personally doubt that NTheory will find a stable "credit factor".
As far as I understand it this would require tasks with similar runtime/CPU-time.
What we have here are runtimes between a few minutes and lots of hours.



Hopefully the new native Theory allows graceful shutdown. Or maybe crunchers can add it by putting a <completion_trigger_file> line in one of the config files.

It's very tricky to implement a method that allows this (based on the current code). A completion_trigger_file or any other trigger would only make sense if you already have such a method.
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Message 38944 - Posted: 23 May 2019, 18:01:43 UTC
Last modified: 23 May 2019, 18:03:17 UTC

This Pythia6 had a problem to finishing successful:
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/workunit.php?wuid=115417792
[boinc pp jets 8000 25 - pythia6 6.428 dwt 100000 60]
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Message 38947 - Posted: 24 May 2019, 12:34:40 UTC - in response to Message 38944.  

This Pythia6 had a problem to finishing successful:
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/workunit.php?wuid=115417792
[boinc pp jets 8000 25 - pythia6 6.428 dwt 100000 60]
From 62 attempts 43 ended successful.

Strange is, that cranky is running for 1 or 1.5 hours and then EXIT_CHILD_FAILED.
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Message 38983 - Posted: 26 May 2019, 19:26:30 UTC

This task ended after 10 Minutes for three Volunteers::
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/workunit.php?wuid=115538576
boinc pp zinclusive 7000 -,-,50,130 - madgraph5amc 2.6.1.atlas default 100000 62]
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Message 38995 - Posted: 29 May 2019, 14:20:52 UTC

This task have a problem after some hours of work:
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/workunit.php?wuid=115589537
[boinc pp jets 8000 25 - pythia8 8.212 tune-A14-CTEQL1 100000 62]
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Message 39000 - Posted: 30 May 2019, 1:04:39 UTC

This task have also a problem to finish for three Volunteers:
https://lhcathome.cern.ch/lhcathome/workunit.php?wuid=115612872
[boinc pp jets 8000 25 - herwig++ 2.6.1a default 100000 62]
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