Message boards : ATLAS application : LHC shuts down, but simulation continues!
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David Cameron
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Message 37499 - Posted: 3 Dec 2018, 14:38:24 UTC

Hi all,

After 4 years the LHC has finished its second run and is now shutting down for 2 years to be upgraded:

https://home.cern/news/press-release/accelerators/lhc-prepares-new-achievements

But don't worry, simulations required by physicists to analyse the data taken over the last 4 years will continue. We should always have plenty of ATLAS tasks to do so keep your machines crunching ATLAS and other LHC projects!
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Message 37501 - Posted: 3 Dec 2018, 16:38:29 UTC - in response to Message 37499.  

keep your machines crunching ATLAS and other LHC projects!
David, what "other projects" do we talk about:

- Sixtrack has tasks available only once in a while
- CMS has been stopped
- LHCb also has been stopped (for monetary reasons, which is sad enough)
- Theory has not been working well for many weeks, and it does not look like as if this will change soon.

Which means that many crunchers with machines with low RAM (and no possibility to upgrade) will NOT be able to crunch LHC projects (for example: what concerns myself - only 2 out of my 5 PCs have more than 4GB RAM, with the other three I cannot crunch ATLAS because of only 4GB and 3 GB RAM).
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Message 37502 - Posted: 3 Dec 2018, 16:51:03 UTC - in response to Message 37501.  

Which means that many crunchers with machines with low RAM (and no possibility to upgrade) will NOT be able to crunch LHC projects (for example: what concerns myself - only 2 out of my 5 PCs have more than 4GB RAM, with the other three I cannot crunch ATLAS because of only 4GB and 3 GB RAM).
Machines with 4GB RAM can crunch ATLAS native tasks (but it has to be at least 4GB RAM, otherwise you won't get tasks).
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Message 37506 - Posted: 3 Dec 2018, 17:29:45 UTC - in response to Message 37502.  

Machines with 4GB RAM can crunch ATLAS native tasks
that's nice, but the OS of all my machines is Windows.
I would be great if at least one of the subprojects other than ATLAS would have tasks - but this is not the case, unfortunately.
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Message 37512 - Posted: 3 Dec 2018, 20:56:52 UTC - in response to Message 37506.  
Last modified: 3 Dec 2018, 21:00:52 UTC

I would be great if at least one of the subprojects other than ATLAS would have tasks...
Sooner or later there will be jobs/tasks be reliably available again.

Just for your information: It seems like you have a PC connected to boinc that is running Windows Vista. Since Windows Vista isn't getting any security updates from Microsoft anymore, it's probably a bad idea to connect this PC to the internet. So you might consider upgrading to a newer Windows version or switch to a Linux based OS.
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Message 37517 - Posted: 4 Dec 2018, 6:17:44 UTC

Well I just reminded myself why I can't run Atlas on all of mine since just getting 2 tasks means this d/l

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Message 37518 - Posted: 4 Dec 2018, 6:41:50 UTC - in response to Message 37517.  

You luckily got some smaller ones.
Downloads can be up to 450 MB, uploads up to 250 MB per task.
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David Cameron
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Message 37542 - Posted: 5 Dec 2018, 10:06:30 UTC - in response to Message 37506.  

Machines with 4GB RAM can crunch ATLAS native tasks
that's nice, but the OS of all my machines is Windows.
I would be great if at least one of the subprojects other than ATLAS would have tasks - but this is not the case, unfortunately.


Yes it is unfortunate that there are no tasks for other projects, but that is not under my control. I can only speak for ATLAS and say we should always have tasks, but I know that they are heavy to run and thus smaller hosts are excluded from any LHC tasks.
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Message 37543 - Posted: 5 Dec 2018, 11:59:35 UTC - in response to Message 37542.  

Machines with 4GB RAM can crunch ATLAS native tasks
that's nice, but the OS of all my machines is Windows.
I would be great if at least one of the subprojects other than ATLAS would have tasks - but this is not the case, unfortunately.


Yes it is unfortunate that there are no tasks for other projects, but that is not under my control. I can only speak for ATLAS and say we should always have tasks, but I know that they are heavy to run and thus smaller hosts are excluded from any LHC tasks.


Well the size of Atlas tasks don't always depend on the CPU or HD size and is a big problem with internet connection d/l - u/l speed/time
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Message 37545 - Posted: 5 Dec 2018, 13:06:37 UTC - in response to Message 37518.  
Last modified: 5 Dec 2018, 13:08:19 UTC

You luckily got some smaller ones.
Downloads can be up to 450 MB, uploads up to 250 MB per task.


If you have a chance to install Linux and cvmfs to receive Atlas native tasks, the downloads will be smaller, too. And the RAM needed, as mentioned above. Good luck!
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Message 37546 - Posted: 5 Dec 2018, 13:33:18 UTC - in response to Message 37545.  

You luckily got some smaller ones.
Downloads can be up to 450 MB, uploads up to 250 MB per task.


If you have a chance to install Linux and cvmfs to receive Atlas native tasks, the downloads will be smaller, too. And the RAM needed, as mentioned above. Good luck!

No.
It's the other way round what makes sense.

Every ATLAS task (native and vbox) downloads an EVNT file (up to 450 MB) and uploads a HITS file (up to 250 MB).
The sizes can be smaller depending on the batch that is currently calculated, e.g. 200/100 MB down/up.

ATLAS native uses an independent local CVMFS instance that is mostly up to date, thus it needs not very much additional download.

ATLAS vbox needs lots of downloads to setup the VM and to update it's degraded CVMFS cache (the vdi is from March 2017) every time you start a fresh VM.
This comes on top of the (up to) 450 MB.
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Message 37548 - Posted: 5 Dec 2018, 17:01:48 UTC - in response to Message 37546.  
Last modified: 5 Dec 2018, 17:28:13 UTC

That's what I said.

The word "no" is for conflicting information. I just said the same thing as you said.
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Message 37553 - Posted: 5 Dec 2018, 18:53:43 UTC - in response to Message 37548.  

... I just said the same thing as you said.

It's not the same thing.

I stated: downloads/uploads can be up to 450/250 MB per task.
That was in reference to MAGIC's download picture.

You stated: this could be reduced by using Linux and the native ATLAS app.


Your statement is wrong. See my explanation.
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Message boards : ATLAS application : LHC shuts down, but simulation continues!


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