21) Questions and Answers : Unix/Linux : code erreur 1 (Message 49246)
Posted 23 Jan 2024 by hadron
Post:
Is user boinc a member of group vboxusers? Run

sudo groups boinc

to find out.
If not, run this to add boinc to vboxusers:

sudo groupmod -a -U boinc vboxusers.

Also, if you want to use b the boinc manager GUI, make sure your user is a member of group boinc:

sudo groupmod -a -U <your_user_name> boinc

Then run

kdesu -u boinc /usr/bin/boincmgr

to start the manager.
22) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48671)
Posted 27 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
The problem with Cosmology tasks is so rare it's not worth my effort to change VB versions
Odd, with me and others complaining in the forum, they break very often. Every single day I had to clear out jammed ones. Problem went away when I went to v5. Maybe only the Windows VB has this problem?

ver 7 is what comes with the distro, so I use it. The biggest problem is that one-day delay in restarting the postponed tasks.
Yes, that was my problem. Once there are loads of them, the queue runs out and I have to nudge them. So if a computer is unattended too long, no Cosmology gets done. V5 just works. Oracle broke it after that. When creating a new version of something, always make it compatible with older things.

Or, the problem simply isn't so prevalent with the Linux version. However, I don't know about other distros than opensuse.

I haven't found a way to change that. I could probably ask in the forums on the Cosmology or Boinc websites, but it's just as easy to abort the problem task and let things carry on.
Restarting Boinc resets the 1 day timer. There must be a way to make it shorter, but I think I asked and it's hard coded.[/quote]
If I restart boinc-client, the stalled task always restarts OK, and things return to normal. I have never had one stall a second time. However, does that not open up the possibility that some LHC tasks will then fail due to a compilation error? At least I have seen a few fail after a restart.
All in all, it seems to me to be best just to abort the errant Cosmology task and carry on.

There is no boinctasks anywhere in the packages available from my distro, nor any package by that name. Besides, if it is a command-line util, I prefer to use a gui when one is available.
Google is your friend.
https://efmer.com/boinctasks/boinctasks-flavours/ - it's a GUI. Don't expect everything to be in the holy repository.

Normally I don't go looking for things I have not heard of ;)
Anyway, boincmgr does all that I need to see right now, but thanks for the info about boinctasks. It definitely looks interesting; I'll be sure to keep it in mind if I want to start looking deeper than boincmgr allows.

AFAIK, for quite some time now, each CPU core has its own math unit, which is shared between the threads the core includes. I guess I'm using the most restrictive possible definition of "core" -- if it includes a math unit, it is worthy of being called a CPU :D
If you call a core a CPU, what do you call the whole CPU?

You can often use all the threads, since the maths unit isn't used 100% of the time, there are memory accesses etc going on aswell, so I treat each thread as a core, so does Boinc.

Recently, I've seen the odd report of upcoming processors that may feature one math unit per thread. If that comes about, then your definition of a CPU and mine will coincide :D
If they have a mathSSS unit per thread, what will they continue to share?

From Intel (see ref 2 at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_processing_unit#cite_note-intel-pcm-2):
A thread is a logical, or virtual, CPU
A core is a (possibly multithreaded) CPU
The big chip that holds them all is a multi-core processor.

"one math unit per thread"
I have no idea what such a processor would be like. Maybe (big guess on my part) they are working on multi-threaded FPUs?
23) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48669)
Posted 27 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
The problem with Cosmology tasks is so rare it's not worth my effort to change VB versions; ver 7 is what comes with the distro, so I use it. The biggest problem is that one-day delay in restarting the postponed tasks. I haven't found a way to change that. I could probably ask in the forums on the Cosmology or Boinc websites, but it's just as easy to abort the problem task and let things carry on.

There is no boinctasks anywhere in the packages available from my distro, nor any package by that name. Besides, if it is a command-line util, I prefer to use a gui when one is available.

AFAIK, for quite some time now, each CPU core has its own math unit, which is shared between the threads the core includes. I guess I'm using the most restrictive possible definition of "core" -- if it includes a math unit, it is worthy of being called a CPU :D
Recently, I've seen the odd report of upcoming processors that may feature one math unit per thread. If that comes about, then your definition of a CPU and mine will coincide :D
24) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48661)
Posted 25 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
@Mr P Hucker
I only allow 2 concurrent Rosetta tasks, so it doesn't affect the other projects all that much. I also guess I didn't fully explain my rationale in checking at the graphs as a first indication of problems. Of course, there are constant fluctuations in the RAC from day to day -- it is the very large drops in RAC that catch my attention. These almost always suggest something that needs further checking. For example, Cosmology tasks sometimes become "stuck"; the VM becomes unmanageable, so boinc postpones further calculations for a full day, 86400 seconds.
During that time, boinc will run any Cosmology tasks that are in queue, but will not request any new ones. In my experience, it also appears that it does not report completed tasks. Given the short run times of these tasks, the queue is quickly emptied of Cosmology tasks. When this happens, the Cosmology RAC will quickly decline by a significant amount. Of course, this issue is also immediately apparent if I just look at the tasks list, but this is not the only problem I've encountered.
Recently, I got quite a few Theory tasks that were all running for just over 9 days, with quite some time showing for the estimated time of completion. With no Atlas tasks available at the time to take up the slack, the LHC RAC was dropping dramatically. In boinc, all looked to be OK -- CPU time was increasing along with run time, checkpoints appeared to be happening regularly, but the time to completion just kept creeping up. Now it was clearly time to check VirtualBox, where I saw the VM was still running, but the guest CPU usage was 0. Time to abort them all, which I did. Did I leave them too long before going to VB? Probably. However, Alt-F2 has never worked here. To gain direct VB access, I had to hack the boinc account to make it a login account, and run VirtualBox in a kdesu shell in my personal account:
kdesu -u boinc VirtualBox.
Once there, moving around is not all that easy -- so I tend to use it as a method of last resort.

The only 24-core Ryzen CPUs I am aware of are a couple of ThreadRippers. I'm happy for you that you can afford not just one, but two, CPUs that combined must have set you back nearly US$3500 :D
25) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48646)
Posted 23 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
As for looking for errors, usually a computation error pops up in yellow on my list. Or I see the CPU% bar drop down and turn white. Or something runs a longer time than expected. I also look at the MSI afterburner graph on every machine each morning, using remote desktop, to make sure nothing is overheating, the CPU isn't throttling the GPU, and all the chips are running flat out.

RAC wouldn't work for me, I keep switching projects, and run projects with a non-constant supply of work.

OK, so you do a detailed check first thing every morning. I check the statistics graphs.
I don't know what you're using where those yellow flags happen -- VirtualBox perhaps? That is my last line of "defence" if I find a problematic task in the boinc manager.
I don't go to that depth unless I see something that suggests a problem somewhere. That, as I said, often begins with a glance at the statistics graphs. Then, I check the tasks for any project where the RAC has been dropping.
I do not switch projects. I run those which are doing things of interest to me -- LHC, Einstein, Cosmology and Rosetta. I have settled on those, and they are not likely to change, at least not in the near future.
Oh, if I had one of those 64-core Threadrippers I mentioned earlier (yeah, I wish!!) then I would also add in a project dealing with climate change. But that isn't going to be happening any time soon -- the CPU alone costs around $10K here in Canada.
26) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48633)
Posted 23 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
Furthermore, it helps if one's contribution to the effort is appreciated by the people who run the projects. The only way I can see for such appreciation to be seen on an ongoing basis is through the credit system.
Cash would be a show of appreciation. Then again there are those who ran Collatz for credit and didn't believe there was a point to the maths. "It takes all sorts to make a world" as my gran used to say.

Well, since it's difficult to transfer cash in a TCP packet....
And I really don't care what the credit wh*res are doing. I run only those projects that are of personal interest to me, and I'm not doing any of this for any bragging rights. If I wanted that, I would have kitted myself out with a Threadripper 5995WX on something like an ASUS Pro WS WRX80E packing 128GB of RAM and a pair of video cards each with 24 GB of memory and something like a Radeon RX 7900 XTX GPU. But even with a system like that, I probably still wouldn't have even half of what some of those RAC wh*res have in their computing arsenal.
As I said, a steady graph of the RAC in the boinc manager statistics graphs shows everything is probably working according to plan -- while a sudden decline in the RAC can indicate some problem(s) in just one quick glance. That is the only reason I need to see the RAC at all, and the only reason I would like the credit per task remain at a constant value per CPU hour -- something which, at present, is certainly not the case with Atlas tasks.
27) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48625)
Posted 22 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
Who cares anyway, credit is just a toy, as long as you get the science done.

Well, for one thing, if the average credit displayed on the boinc manager statistics screen is chugging away at a constant level, then suddenly drops unexpectedly, then it is time to go looking for signs of a problem -- such as tasks which suddenly start failing in droves.
Furthermore, it helps if one's contribution to the effort is appreciated by the people who run the projects. The only way I can see for such appreciation to be seen on an ongoing basis is through the credit system.
28) Message boards : Theory Application : No Tasks (Message 48619)
Posted 22 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
Project-Server say no tasks for Theory.

I was getting Theory tasks right up until the moment I started running Atlas tasks on 8 threads. Now boinc is telling me I "don't need" any new tasks every time it asks for new tasks.
The server status says there are over 4000 Theory tasks waiting to be sent out.
29) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48618)
Posted 22 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
What gives? For one Atlas task, running on 4 threads, I get a credit of nearly 13,000. For another task, running on 8 threads, I get credit of only 3200. Both tasks required nearly the same amount of CPU time, over 530,000 secs.
30) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48550)
Posted 15 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
Of course I use multiple threads, ATLAS is designed for this. I've left it on the default of 8 threads per task, it tends to average 7, so that's what I told the scheduler via app_config.

    <app_version>
        <app_name>ATLAS</app_name>
        <plan_class>vbox64_mt_mcore_atlas</plan_class>
        <cmdline></cmdline>
        <avg_ncpus>7.000000</avg_ncpus>
        <ngpus>0.000000</ngpus>
    </app_version>

I haven't overclocked.

When I set the max threads on LHC, all I got were Atlas tasks. I also want to run Theory tasks, so I set LHC to use only 1 thread, then in app_config added a <cmdline>... entry to app_config to control the number of threads directly. It did what I wanted it to do, so that is what I will do again once these 4 tasks are finished (I've temporarily disabled Atlas tasks on LHC).
In addition to the LHC tasks, I'm also running Rosetta, Einstein and Cosmology tasks, so I am certainly not inclined to dedicate 7 threads per Atlas task alone -- initially, I'll set my app_config file to run only 1 Atlas task at a time, on 4 threads, and see where that takes me:

    <app>
        <name>ATLAS</name>
        <max_concurrent>1</max_concurrent>
    </app>
    <app_version>
        <app_name>ATLAS</app_name>
        <avg_ncpus>4</avg_ncpus>
        <plan_class>vbox64_mt_mcore_atlas</plan_class>
        <cmdline>--nthreads 4</cmdline>
    </app_version>

Once I see how this works out, I can easily make changes to suit my preferences.

Thanks for the replies, they've been quite helpful. I'll post again once I see where this takes me.
31) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48548)
Posted 15 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
hadron wrote:
Lucky you. I have 4 Atlas tasks running right now. They've been running for 2 days 10 hours, and still have 2 hours to go.
17.5 hours total to run here on a Ryzen 9 3900XT, unfortunately boinc has decided to run something else and interrupted it. I set them to stay in memory while suspended which really helps.

Are you overclocking your CPU? Or maybe running each task on multiple threads?
I have a Ryzen 9 5900X which has almost the same base frequency as the 3900XT, so I would expect your times and mine should be roughly equal.
32) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48546)
Posted 15 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
First Atlas Win11pro with 400 events finished successful,
Laufzeit 1 Stunden 26 min. 42 sek.
CPU Zeit 8 Stunden 16 min. 1 sek.

Lucky you. I have 4 Atlas tasks running right now. They've been running for 2 days 10 hours, and still have 2 hours to go.
33) Message boards : ATLAS application : queue is empty (Message 48538)
Posted 11 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
Sounds good to me.

Thanks for picking this up this project!

+923875

Let's get going!
34) Message boards : Number crunching : oracle vm not detected boinc linux mint (Message 48537)
Posted 11 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
je voudrais simplement faire comme sous windows.
installer virtualbox,boinctasks puis boinc et que cela fonctionne sans probleme du premier coup.

I would just like to do as under windows.
install virtualbox,boinctasks then boinc and that it works without problems the first time.
merci thank you


I use opensuse, so I do not know how to install boinc and virtualbox in Linux Mint. You may need to add one or two additional repositories to be able to do this; if necessary, you should ask in the Mint forums.

Install boinc and virtualbox. You must ensure that you have installed the boinc-client and boinc-manager as well as the libraries and the language translations. For virtualbox, you must make sure the kernel modules are installed.

Add your own user to group boinc: sudo usermod -aG boinc your_username_here
Enable boinc so it will start each time you reboot: systemctl enable boinc-client
Add user boinc to group vboxusers: sudo usermod -aG vboxusers boinc
(this step is essential to permit the boinc client to run tasks that run under vbox).

Reboot the system. Log in under your user account, and start the boinc manager. You may now proceed to add the projects you wish to run.
35) Message boards : Number crunching : oracle vm not detected boinc linux mint (Message 48520)
Posted 8 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
In the current version of boinc on Linux you need to dissable some security for VBox tasks to work.

sed -i 's/ProtectSystem=strict/ProtectSystem=full/g' /lib/systemd/system/boinc-client.service


1. That option is not even set in the version offered by opensuse. Which distro are you using; and are you using that distro's version?
2. It is not a good idea to edit systemd service files directly, as these will be overwritten at the next update. Instead, use systemctl. As root, run:
systemctl edit boinc-client.service
This will create an override file in /etc/systemd/system/boinc-client.service.d/override.conf
36) Message boards : Number crunching : oracle vm not detected boinc linux mint (Message 48503)
Posted 7 Sep 2023 by hadron
Post:
hello I’ve been trying for a while to run lhc@home under linux mint directly or virtual machine but it seems complicated.
a charitable soul could post a detailed and recent tutorial with step-by-step installation of boinc with oracle virtualbox and the lhc@home project.
It’s been about 5 times that I start again but in vain. There are so many different and not recent sources in the forums that I no longer know what to do and I would like to abandon windows for linux.
thank you in advance

You don't say what your specific problem is, so I am just going to say what is the minimum you need to do to get boinc and virtualbox to work together.

First, you need to add your user account to group boinc. Without this, you cannot connect to the boinc client from the boinc GUI manager. I suspect (though do not know) that you will also not be able to connect to the client on the command line using boinccmd.
Next, you must add user boinc to group vboxusers. This is necessary to allow the boinc client to communicate with the virtual machines it is running. Without this, every task running in a VM will fail immediately.

I hope this is useful to you.
37) Questions and Answers : Unix/Linux : Boinc essentially stopped asking for LHC work (Message 48110)
Posted 16 May 2023 by hadron
Post:
From opensuse.org
<snip snip snip>

Did you notice the Tumbleweed boinc package, ver 7.22, marked "Official"? It's in the official openSUSE repos, obviously, and it wouldn't be there unless it was an official release.
The same version can be found in the repos at https://download.opensuse.org/repositories/network/ for both Leap 15.4 and 15.5, as well as SLE 15. I think that makes these official as well.

As far as 7.18 is concerned, I know what Boinc says, and I also know that that version, which is in the main installation repository for Leap 15.4 (and hence is necessarily an official openSUSE release), does work in Linux, and has been working here, since I installed it last Sept when I first began running Boinc projects.

The "experimental" stuff is all restricted to the developers' personal workspaces, where they are free to do what they want to get something to compile. Nothing gets out into the repos on download.opensuse.org unless it's been properly vetted and tested, and is known to be stable in a typical running system. The bottom line is simple: if I can find something in an SLE repository, it must be an official version (care to take a guess why?).
38) Questions and Answers : Unix/Linux : Boinc essentially stopped asking for LHC work (Message 48103)
Posted 16 May 2023 by hadron
Post:
openSUSE Leap 15.4, fully updated
...
Boinc 7.18.1 w/VirtualBox 7.0.6, both sourced from openSUSE repositories.

OpenSuse does not distribute official BOINC or VirtualBox packets for Leap 15.4.
What they offer is marked as "experimental; use at your own risk".

You have what I can only say is a unique understanding of the meaning of "experimental". If a distro's developers download the source code of an official release, and compile it specifically for their distro, it does not suddenly become "experimental".

Beside that BOINC 7.18.1 was never released for any Linux distribution.
Instead it was an Android only release.

That may be, but I have been running these versions of Boinc and VBox since they were installed, without problem until now. Moreover, every other project I'm running (Einstein, Cosmology and Rosetta) is having no problems at all.

Mon 15 May 2023 08:48:09 PM | LHC@home | Not requesting tasks: don't need ()

You may first upgrade BOINC, then adjust your work buffer size and check your local prefs (especially the allowed RAM).

There is nothing wrong with my local prefs either. I have been running with these prefs since about 2 weeks after I first began running Boinc last September. Everything has been behaving pretty much the way I want, again until now.

Edit: Well, I am baffled. About an hour ago, a whole bunch of Theory tasks suddenly started arriving. Now I have 20 of them, and all appears to be OK once more.
39) Questions and Answers : Unix/Linux : Boinc essentially stopped asking for LHC work (Message 48101)
Posted 16 May 2023 by hadron
Post:
Have set prefs to Atlas and Theory and get both or one of them.

I forgot to say that I set it back to getting both.
That still doesn't solve the problem, which is no matter what I do, I only receive one WU at a time, and I will not get another one until that has been reported.
40) Questions and Answers : Unix/Linux : Boinc essentially stopped asking for LHC work (Message 48098)
Posted 16 May 2023 by hadron
Post:
openSUSE Leap 15.4, fully updated
Kernel version: 5.14.21
Boinc 7.18.1 w/VirtualBox 7.0.6, both sourced from openSUSE repositories.

Since just before 12:00 UTC on 12 May, my system has not been fetching more than one work unit at a time. So long as I have one WU running, any fetch try fails with "Don't need()" Event log extract as follows:
Mon 15 May 2023 03:48:04 PM | LHC@home | Scheduler request completed
Mon 15 May 2023 03:48:04 PM | LHC@home | Project requested delay of 6 seconds
Mon 15 May 2023 08:48:09 PM | LHC@home | Sending scheduler request: Requested by project.
Mon 15 May 2023 08:48:09 PM | LHC@home | Not requesting tasks: don't need ()
Mon 15 May 2023 08:48:11 PM | LHC@home | Scheduler request completed

I have reset LHC in Boinc to no avail -- I received one Atlas task only, and setting my project preferences to Theory only did nothing.
I am at a loss as to what to try next. I thought perhaps I might need to delete and reinstall the LHC project in Boinc, but thought I should ask in here first in case there is something else I might try first.


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