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41)
Message boards :
LHC@home Science :
BBC Radio coverage of CERN and the LHC
(Message 19587)
Posted 1 May 2008 by  Neasan
Post: Keep it down but BBC Radio 4 is planning to broadcast for an entire day from CERN later in the year. This will be the first time they have ever done that and EVERY programme will be CERN based (even women's hour) |
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42)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19586)
Posted 1 May 2008 by Neasan
Post:
LHC is funded by countries who just happen to be the CERN member states and it is also based at CERN. CERN is separate but involved in the LHC. LHC@home is funded by no one, Alex and I donate our time for free and the hardware here at QMUL was donated by GridPP, sometimes we get students to work on the project but that is in 3 month bursts and we never know what will come out the other end. CERN owns the cern.ch domain and as we are on that they have a right to tell us to take down content they feel is inappropriate, the other option was they turned off lhcathome.cern.ch pointing at our server. The work we do here is valuable to the LHC but when lined up against everything else they are pumping money into we come quite far down the food chain. The experiments and the LHC have priorities and we are not a top one for them, they will use whatever data we provide but as with all science we have to stand on our own two feet and not just hope and pray for handouts (though we do that too). I've been off for the last week (supporting awesome) so haven't been on here for a while. |
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43)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19529)
Posted 24 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post:
Sadly a) that's not how it works and b) LHC doesn't actually have much money CERN != LHC ;-)
No, SixTrack will keep being used to tweak the magnets how regular that will be is up in the air (but then it is like that now anyway) and may have other uses.
This is being worked on but there is a lot of feet dragging going on |
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44)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19523)
Posted 23 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post:
However this would require a person to port the software from the current Grid setup to BOINC and for the Grid software to be actually portable. Not only do we not have this person (see the money issue above) we have also been told that there is no way the applications the Grid runs are lightweight enough to be ported to BOINC. We keep prodding and asking about simulation applications/other experiments etc but nothing so far.
There are rules about this i.e. it's not allowed. ATLAS does sell stuff but they seem to be bending the rules and it doesn't bring them in much money either. In the end we need someone to give us the money we need, and we keep bidding for money trying to get up and running as best we can and we haven't got it. I know that sounds crap but that is how science is financed across the globe. If we are successful you will be the first to know and the first to benefit. We hope to have some summer students this year too, I know I bad mouthed them above kinda but they are great at getting some small stuff done which in the end benefits the entire project. OK it's not the best solution but it is all we have got :-/ |
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45)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19516)
Posted 22 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: That number is for the best case scenario i.e. some one full time for two years to really get the project moving with upgrades, new applications, public engagement. This has always been our plan (and still is) and it is hard finding people to fund it but as you can see two people working on it in their spare time with the occasional summer student for 3 months doesn't meet everyone's demands. Alex and I will still keep plugging away but this really is a full time job to be done to satisfy everyone (not just the volunteers) and we will keep applying for funding to make this project as great as it can be but until then we have to keep it running as best we can and sometimes that means just making sure that the scientists can submit their work, that everyone gets a fair chance to get some of it and that it all gets returned to the scientists(even during the recent downtime this happened). |
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46)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19514)
Posted 22 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: a) We have a second project it's called the Grid. The LHC's computing needs are being fulfilled by that IF we can get something ported to BOINC we will but I reiterate we have no money. Also it's not just the download are you all willing to have large, hard drives, massive broadband connections and run only Scientific Linux (CERN edition) and not use your machines for anything else? The approximate amount of money needed to fund someone to actually do everything everyone wants done (that is with all full economic costings etc etc) |
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47)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19508)
Posted 21 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: a) We have a second project it's called the Grid. The LHC's computing needs are being fulfilled by that IF we can get something ported to BOINC we will but I reiterate we have no money. Also it's not just the download are you all willing to have large, hard drives, massive broadband connections and run only Scientific Linux (CERN edition) and not use your machines for anything else? £150,000 |
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48)
Message boards :
Cafe LHC :
Answering of questions by LHC@home staff
(Message 19481)
Posted 18 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: Yeah he is based in Triumf in Vancouver, I was over there last September for CHEP and we were meant to meet to discuss this but he couldn't make it. |
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49)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
Ridding computer of Pending Units
(Message 19480)
Posted 18 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: Any chance you could just do a manual clearing of the ancient results? I'm guessing the data is long gone... not sure if it would be as simple as a "delete from result where create_time < 1136091600" (January 1, 2006) but if it is, we could all finally get started on cleaning up our host lists! :D I'll ask the other muppet in charge, he's off working on T2K at the mo. |
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50)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19479)
Posted 18 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: a) We have a second project it's called the Grid. The LHC's computing needs are being fulfilled by that IF we can get something ported to BOINC we will but I reiterate we have no money. Also it's not just the download are you all willing to have large, hard drives, massive broadband connections and run only Scientific Linux (CERN edition) and not use your machines for anything else? b) Now if I'd know there were workunits coming I could have told you all yesterday but oh no the first I know of it is when I come on here to check the boards, ARGH! |
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51)
Questions and Answers :
Unix/Linux :
FreeBSD port
(Message 19463)
Posted 17 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: darwin (Mac os X) is not supported too and lhc@home. I don't think LHC calculation required anything very specific (no gui for example) and port for other unix should be possible. Thank you. The people who created SixTrack choose a strange compiler (don't ask why I don't know) and this means that there are only Linux and Windows applications for LHC@home. Also this: The argument that "our compiler generates code only for a given platform" only proves the speaker's incompetence in using devices such as computers. Bang out of order I support Open Source (FF, TB, OOo etc etc) and run a system based on BSD (OSX) but this kind of zealot talk gives the community a bad name. If we could port to BSD and OSX we would have by now, if only because a few people involved down the years (including myself) are Mac users. As for making the code open source that is not my decision to make but you don't need to run it if it hurts your sensibilities (and I bet I will find identical posts on other BOINC forums from you stating similar things about other projects) but I don't think you'll be modelling any supermagnets in large particle accelerators any time soon. |
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52)
Questions and Answers :
Windows :
DLL initialization error
(Message 19462)
Posted 17 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: I have bee trying to see what we can do, apparently there is an update of SixTrack coming (don't hold your breath I sure ain't) so that may relieve the problem. I've been trying to get some meaningful information about this from someone but the problem is a little vague diagnose. I am working on this I just try and keep quiet around here. |
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53)
Message boards :
Cafe LHC :
Answering of questions by LHC@home staff
(Message 19461)
Posted 17 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: I was wondering why I see numerous questions by people helping LHC@home that are ignored. Does the LHC@home staff consist of just two people? As a professional astronomer I can truely say that if my students or those who are helping in a research project didn't feel they could come up to me freely and ask a question pertaining to astronomy then they wouldn't be inspired to have astronomy or atro-physics as a major would they? Key word is professional here. LHC@home is not our job and neither Alex nor I are paid to do this (there is no money for the project fullstop) we have to squeeze it in along with all our various preparations for the actual LHC's turn on later this year. Also when a student approaches you he has no record of previous conversations you have had with students, here there is a whole board of people asking the same question "I have a WU pending for so long", "why is there no work" etc etc and these are all answered by some lovely users (we appreciate their patience) despite the fact that they have already answered the question numerous times. To change your analogy what if a student asked a question in your lecture which you have just explained (fair enough) which you clearly explain again, then 2 minutes later in the same lecture another student asks the same identical question which you again explain, now imagine every student in your lecture asking that question one after another seemingly unaware that you have just answered that question n times. We can't be on here answering those questions all the time but those lovely users mentioned above help us (again thank you to them) and answer the questions every single time. |
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54)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
Ridding computer of Pending Units
(Message 19460)
Posted 17 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post:
I'm allowed have a little fun now and then, I think ... Yes the code is old, yes I want to upgrade, when that will happen is a sticking point for me as well as you. |
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55)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
How often does LHC shut down?
(Message 19459)
Posted 17 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: I would be willing to bet that if they did a port of their analysis program to BOINC we could do as well as the super computers they have lined up to do their data . Not a chance, a single dataset which a machine needs would be at least 1 gigabyte of data and your machine would have to download that before it could do anything else. We are TRYING to find something from the analysis of real data that will port but the big four have told us that the code is too, lets say, verbose. To address the other complaints, the reason you hear nothing from me and Alex is: a) We are not told, despite numerous times asking for notification, when new work is going up (and yes the work is being done in Triumf in Canada) b) We have nothing to say, there is no news, sadly with both of us involved in particle physics it is quite a busy period for us (I've had to field questions about the Grid replacing the Internet caused by a very very poor article in the Sunday Times of all places) We would love to tell you when work is coming and how much, we would also love to be able to dedicate all our time to get LHC@home to be the great project it can be but there is no money (we applied, we failed) and time is at a premium. I can assure I am pushing for more work (we honestly have stuff on the horizon but sometimes people can drag their feet when they hit an obstacle and that keeps happening), for an upgrade of the site code and want to keep you informed but there is nothing to say. I am on the boards most days reading comments and they mostly don't require a reply as the all focus on "why is there no work" or "the codebase is old" and they have been addressed many times by myself and by the sticky above. I understand your frustration and wish I could say or do something but my hands are tied. |
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56)
Message boards :
Number crunching :
Is This Spam?
(Message 19350)
Posted 11 Apr 2008 by Neasan
Post: As with the upgrade this was out of my hands. I did note your post and told the relevant people at the time but in the end it took a threat from CERN to get anything done. Make of that what you will. I apologise but some of the stuff that needs to be done is a little outside my expertise (I know very little MYSQL etc) and while I'd generally jump in two feet first and mess around this usually breaks something and as a rule effects no one but this project is a little bigger. |
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57)
Message boards :
Cafe LHC :
Anyone have some good song selections to share?
(Message 19206)
Posted 12 Mar 2008 by Neasan
Post: My selection on the pub jukebox last night: Primordial - Heathen Tribes Primordial - Empires Fall Dio - Stand Up And Shout Thin Lizzy - Emerald |
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58)
Message boards :
Cafe LHC :
MyMiniCity
(Message 19155)
Posted 3 Mar 2008 by Neasan
Post: We're flying, I'm gobsmacked we have high unemployment so need some clicks on: Now we need Transport http://lhchome.myminicity.com/tra |
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59)
Message boards :
Cafe LHC :
MyMiniCity
(Message 19154)
Posted 3 Mar 2008 by Neasan
Post: We're flying, I'm gobsmacked we have high unemployment so need some clicks on: http://lhchome.myminicity.com/ind |
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60)
Message boards :
Cafe LHC :
MyMiniCity
(Message 19152)
Posted 3 Mar 2008 by Neasan
Post: Actually I've started an LHC@home one now: LHC@home I've out it in the UK let's see how big we can make it Image created by the script at http://www.gamingg.net/scripts.php?id=myminicity |
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